First let me start out by saying that I LOVE my King James Bible! It has been my preferred study Bible for 40 years – essentially since I was old enough to read it. I definitely do not enjoy dealing with KJV Only types though, but that’s another story. Those people follow me around like hound dogs always going off on me anytime I challenge the alleged “perfection” of that particular translation as if I just insulted their own personal god – you know, the fourth person of the Trinity. And they are stuck in the most ridiculous loop of circular reasoning you can ever observe in any debate. And when it comes to the issue of the flat Earth, there are some die-hard KJV Only types who just can’t handle the facts.
I am now going to openly challenge all of you who are absolutely convinced the KJV is the end-all-be-all English translation but who are opposed to the idea that the Bible is a flat earth book. I’m sorry, but you might as well just sign up to become a flat earther now, because you absolutely have no case for a spinning, heliocentric, globular Earth model from your King James Bible – so, please pay close attention Mike Hoggard, Stephen Anderson, Kent and Eric Hovind (and possibly David Reeves too) and others who are of the same or similar mindset.
I’ve specifically heard Mike, Stephen and Kent boldly proclaim that they hold their King James Bible to be the absolute source of LITERAL truth and that no other Bible compares to it. If you are going to use a Bible to make your case, it BETTER be the KJV. OK. Well, I’m going to issue a public challenge to each of these gentlemen to prove the Earth is a spinning, heliocentric, globe in an ever expanding universe. And I’m going to demand (as most KJV Only types usually do) that since we speak ENGLISH here, this means you CAN NOT use any other source material apart from the King James ENGLISH Bible for your position. No fair trying to manipulate the Hebrew and Greek now. Just stick to your “perfect” translation and lets look at a few facts.
When describing the Earth, we consistently see in the KJV words and phrases such as…
The phrase “IN the earth” appears 76 times. The phrase “ON the earth” appears 35 times. OK. Not exactly a slam dunk, but there are definitely more than twice as many references to being IN the earth – and it doesn’t mean as in to be inside a cave. So, here we have a much stronger case for the earth as an enclosed system (as in under the firmament), rather than an open system of a ball that has a surface to stand on. Speaking of, we also see…
The phrase “FACE of the earth” appears 29 times. The phrase “SURFACE of the earth” appears 0 times! Why is this significant? Well, the above mentioned theologians consistently want to argue that Isaiah’s “circle of the earth” really means a sphere and that a circle is a 2 dimensional object. They then mock and say that Flat Earthers need to learn basic geometry.
OK. In geometry, there is no such thing as the “face” of a sphere.
Rather, you can only use the word “surface” for a sphere. That’s basic geometry. Might want to look it up…
At this point the game is over for you. But let’s go ahead and continue just for the fun of it…
If you suggest that our heads are roughly spherical and we have a face as your argument, it still fails.
Yes, the roughly spherical nature of our heads does have a face, but it is the “front” part of that sphere. It is the principally dressed portion that communicates. Where then is the “front” of the globe? What is its principally dressed portion? And if you only identify one area of the globe, what do we do with the rest of it? You can’t just have a “face” on a globe that has land all around it.
Whereas using the phrase “face of the earth” – especially where it says (6 times) “the face of the WHOLE EARTH” – is a perfect fit when you consider the earth is only described in terms of a circle – twice in fact: once in Proverbs 8:27 when we learn that YHWH “set a compass upon the face of the deep” and confirmed by the second witness of Isaiah’s famous 22nd verse in the 40th chapter. But how many times does the KJV describe the earth as spherical? Oh yeah… IT DOESN”T! A keyword search on “sphere” yields zero results in any context. What about globe? Nope. Zero results. How about a ball? Well, we do have ONE reference to a ball and it’s by the same guy who told us the shape of the earth no less! Funny how that worked out. You’d think of all people, the guy you KJV Only types want to quote for your justification of a spherical earth apparently knew the difference and chose an entirely different word when describing the shape of the earth.
So, we have the solid KJV Biblical evidence of a circular earth that has a “face” – something not possible on the geometric shape known as a sphere – and we have the evidence of the phrase “IN the earth” being used 76 times. Let’s continue…
We find in the two witnesses of Isaiah and John that the earth has four corners. This makes perfect sense in the circular earth model, since we’ve seen that the circle was “set” (better understood as INSCRIBED) on the face of the deep:
Where are the four corners on the KJV unsupported notion of a spherical earth? North, South, East and West? That’s the usual “apologetic” I hear for this question. For instance, GotQuestions.org explains…
Many a skeptic claims that the Bible depicts a flat earth. Scriptural references such as Revelation 7:1 are cited, which speaks of “four angels standing at the four corners of the earth.” However, this passage makes reference to the cardinal directions as seen on a compass – i.e. north, south, east and west.
Uhm… OK. It says “corners,” which implies end points. Does a sphere have edges/ends/points?
Nope. So where is the point at which one reaches East? What about West? Last I heard/seen, there are no East and West poles, points or corners anywhere on the globe. So, help me out here. And while you are at it, if you believe the “four corners of the earth” are end points that can be specifically defined as East and West, then please help us to know how we are to deal with what the Psalmist wrote here:
Psalm 103:12 As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.
If you are correct in the ridiculous claim that the four corners of the KJV are a reference to the four cardinal directions, then you have the Psalmist telling us that YHWH only removes our sins about 11,495.367 miles away, between the two “antipodes” of some mystical East and West targets on the globe. That would indeed be depressing if true. Fortunately for all of us, you guys are wrong, and the KJV is correct. Biblically speaking, the earth is not a sphere. It does have four corners and East and West do NOT have end points.
We have 28 references to the “ends of the earth” in the King James Bible. Exactly at what point do you reach on a ball that you can say you’ve arrived at an end, with no further direction to go? Does not the ball still continue in all directions no matter where you stand on it?
We have at least 3 references to the “pillars of the earth”. How many references do we have for the “core of the earth”? Oops. None. So, while you desperately try to force the “pillars of the earth” into some picture of the interior core of a spherical planet, the KJV provides absolutely no justification for such a view.
We have at least 7 KJV references telling us the earth has a foundation and that it is stationary and not moving. Apart from earthquakes and Divine judgment, there is no precedence for stating that the earth is in any form of motion. And certainly nothing whatsoever to support any concept of rotating or orbiting around the sun, which didn’t even show up until Day 4 after the earth was already in place and producing life!
There are over 60 references to the motion of the sun, moon and stars in the Bible. NOT ONE in reference to the specific motion of earth as the cause of those “perceived motions.” Quite the contrary. If your KJV is indeed the final authority, then what gives you the right to change what it actually says and demand that it is simply an illusion from the author’s perspective? Sorry, but Joshua commanded the sun and moon to stand still. He did NOT command the earth to stop rotating (which is what would be required in order to achieve the stopping of the sun in your model)! And the situation is even worse for you when you consider the sun dial of Hezekiah going backwards ten degrees.
You really don’t have to go much further than the first chapter of Genesis to see that your spinning, heliocentric, globular earth in an ever expanding universe model is NOT Biblical. There is only ONE firmament and the sun, moon and stars were placed IN it (over the circular inscribed earth that Job, Solomon and Isaiah would later describe for us). With all due respect, the heavenly luminaries were NOT placed outside and all around the earth as your “canopy theory” demands Dr. Hovind.
Also, the firmament is a solid structure! No where can any of you prove it to be anything other than that.
I could go on and on with this stuff. But I’ll stop here.
OK. So now if you are a KJV Only type especially, please give us your answers to the following 10 simple questions:
- Where do you see any description of the earth as a sphere in the KJV?
- Where do you see the KJV referencing anything about the SURFACE of the earth?
- What are the four corners of a globe?
- Where are the ends of the globe?
- Where does the KJV indicate that we have a “core” for a spherical earth?
- Where does the KJV ever tell us the earth is spinning and/or in any form of motion?
- Using your KJV, tell us exactly how did the sun and moon stand still with Joshua’s command?
- Tell us how did the sun’s shadow go backward ten degrees in the book of Isaiah?
- Where does the KJV tell us in both examples (Joshua’s and Hezekiah’s) that the earth spun itself back up to 1,000 mph, resuming its 66,600 mph orbital speed?
- Where in the KJV do we see any Creation description even remotely hinting at the earth being a planet in a “solar system” orbiting the sun?
And we don’t want to hear and see your fancy tap dancing to try and explain these things away. Just give us Scripture for your support.
Now YOU claim the KJV is the authority. YOU claim it as your source for truth! YOU claim we don’t need to understand Hebrew or Greek and that the KJV is the preserved, purified seven times, perfect, infallible word of God. So, as I see it, by your own definitions and standards, since I already know you can’t really address the above questions in support of a spherical earth, you’re going to have NO CHOICE but to either accept or reject the facts it gives us as clearly described above. I choose to except these facts. Now what are you KJV Only types going to do with them? If you choose to do anything short of agree, then I’m just going to call you out right here and say you are lying hypocrites who do NOT believe your own words that you hold all of us accountable to, nor do you believe the Holy Spirit inspired authors of the original texts, nor the “perfect” translation you hold as the standard for those of us who speak English.
Like it or not, believe it or not, accept it or not… your King James Bible clearly indicates a circular, still flat earth, set on pillars, under a dome (firmament), within which the sun, moon and stars were placed on Day 4 of Creation. Period. And good luck trying to claim otherwise.
– Rob Skiba